Taking pride in Canadian innovation: Deb Pimentel of IBM Canada

“Pepper”:

I love IBM.

Deb Pimentel

Thank you. I love IBM too.

Goldy Hyder

That’s Deb Pimentel, IBM Canada’s president and GM of technology.

She’s speaking with a robot named “Pepper” at the IBM Canada Software Lab in Markham, Ontario.

“Pepper”

The IBM Canada lab is an amazing place to work.

Goldy Hyder

It’s Canada’s largest software development lab, and IBM’s third-largest in the world.

In November, Deb gave me a tour.

Here, Canadian ingenuity is on full display.

Some of the world’s top scientists, computer specialists, and problem solvers are developing cutting-edge, technical solutions for clients, not only here in Canada, but around the world.

On the tour, Deb introduced me to Vince Pasquantonio in a part of the lab known as “Area 631”

Vince Pasquantonio

This is our incubation space for our development organizations. So 631 stands for six innovators, three months, one breakthrough. And what we do is its open to everyone in the lab. Sometimes when you work for a large company, things move a little bit slow when you follow the formal process. But we throw the team in here-

Goldy Hyder

Yeah. Break some eggs here. Right?

Vince Pasquantonio

There’s no rules.

Deb Pimentel

That’s what we’re doing. Yeah.

Goldy Hyder

Break some eggs.

Vince Pasquantonio

Forget that you work for IBM. There’s no rules come out with a breakthrough and idea.

Goldy Hyder

That’s great.

Vince Pasquantonio

And it’s been pretty successful for us.

Goldy Hyder:

Welcome to Speaking of Business: Conversations with Canadian innovators, entrepreneurs, and leaders.

I’m Goldy Hyder, president and CEO of the Business Council of Canada.

IBM has a long history in Canada. It opened its first Canadian facility nearly 100 years ago, and it now employs thousands of people not just here in Markham but right across the country.

It was a thrill to visit with Deb Pimentel and learn more about Canada’s impressive contributions to the parent company.

Welcome to the podcast, Deb.

Deb Pimentel

Thanks, Goldy.

Goldy Hyder

So, you and I have just had the pleasure of taking a full tour of your facility, parts of which have just been renovated, and new, and modernized. I see lots of people working in here, excited to be here. And I want to introduce IBM to our listeners for sure. But I want to start with you. I want to start with you, and your story, and your career journey.

We were talking earlier about how we were raised with parents who ran family businesses, small businesses, the heartbeat of Canada in many ways. Tell me about your upbringing. Tell me about the impact that it had on you just watching your parents build a business.

Deb Pimentel

Well, my parents are immigrants. They came from Portugal, more specifically, the Azores. And I grew up above our grocery store. So, we had a grocery store. They came to Canada-

Goldy Hyder

In Toronto?

Deb Pimentel

In Toronto. Right downtown Toronto. And so, that’s how I grew up. I was six years old, working in the grocery store with my parents. They bought it. It was a small little corner store, and then we expanded from there.And so, I learned a lot from working with my parents, and the community around us, because we were surrounded with a lot of immigrants at the time.

Goldy Hyder

Tell me what you learned.

Deb Pimentel

What did I learn? I learned perseverance. So, they didn’t know how to speak English at first. They learned. They created a community around them. They grew a small little business into I think a very successful community supermarket where once my dad decided to retire, there was a party for him, and he was written up in the National Post at the time, because he made such an impact. So-

Goldy Hyder

He had ambition.

Deb Pimentel

… the perseverance. Him thinking about different ways to do things. I like to say we were the original GroceryGateway.com. Right? So, we used to deliver around our neighborhood.

So, the other thing was the patience. So, day-to-day, he would always say to me … My parents both worked there. They would always say, “The customer is always right.” So, they would come in … It was about creating that experience for them when they came in. That’s where I learned that ethic of making it about your client, and if we didn’t have something, we’re going to get it for you. So, it was all about the experience that we were creating for our community, it was all about thinking of different ways to be different, especially as the community grew around us. Like, bigger stores started to come around. How do you differentiate yourself? So, all of those things-

Goldy Hyder

An MBA. All-in-one-

Deb Pimentel

Oh, yeah. And a lot of people say this, but the work ethic that I’ve got, I absolutely learned from my parents. They would get up early in the morning-

Goldy Hyder

Whatever it takes.

Deb Pimentel

… go to the food terminal, whatever they need to do, snowing, raining, sick, always got up, because the business had to run every single day. So, that, I learned from my parents. I’m pretty proud of that.

Goldy Hyder

They must be so proud of you.

Deb Pimentel

They are. They are. I am very, very proud of the … It was different. Right? Because you don’t know what’s the Canadian identity, and then you have … But we do want to honour our Portuguese background too. And it just became a beautiful thing, as you grow up, because it was one and the same. So, we were allowed to celebrate our heritage, but, at the same time, we … That is what makes Canada so great is how diverse we are, and the different backgrounds that we’ve got. I learned to appreciate that growing up downtown Toronto, and with my family.

Goldy Hyder

It certainly seems to be our USP. Isn’t it?

Deb Pimentel

Yes. Yes.

Goldy Hyder

And you must see that in the global network of IBM, and their … Tell me a little bit about how Canada’s perceived within that network.

Deb Pimentel

IBM before it became IBM, it was the computer tabulating company. But once it moved out of the United States, one of the first places it came to was in Canada. So, we became IBM, International Business Machines, I like to say, because of Canada-

Goldy Hyder

Canada was international. Yeah.

Deb Pimentel

I like to say it’s because of Canada. But we are very prominent. Like, we’ve got a very strong voice. We’re not the largest country, obviously, but because we have so much here, and we’re so close to our headquarters, which happens to be in Armonk. We’re very relevant to the organization. We also bring a lot of our leaders, global leaders together very often, and then we make sure that we have a voice in that space.

Goldy Hyder

I’m going to come back to more about IBM, but I want to come back to you before we move to other things, and that is so you grew up the way you’ve described, and then you went off to university.

Deb Pimentel

Yeah.

Goldy Hyder

How did you end up being where you are-

Deb Pimentel

First person in this generation in my family to go to university. Was determined that I wanted to do that. And then I just really-

Goldy Hyder

For psychology, if I recall correctly-

Deb Pimentel

Well, it was business and psychology. I couldn’t figure out what I wanted to do when I grew up.

Goldy Hyder:

You’re not the only one.

Deb Pimentel

Yeah. And I love studying, and I love school. So, I did a few things. And so, the interesting thing is I intended, fully intended on continuing school. So, I wanted to do my MBA next, because I loved it. And I went to a networking event at the university, and met a bunch of different companies, and then I was about to leave, and I went to go grab water, and started talking to this gentleman that was grabbing a water as well, and fast-forward, he worked at IBM. I had created … My uncle worked for a small printing company at the time, and I had created a business card that said my name, and my graduating date, like, May 1995.

Goldy Hyder

Available.

Deb Pimentel

Yeah. “Available for employment, and here’s my …” So, it was, like, a small little resume on a business card. And I gave it to him. And then, all of a sudden, I got a call from him, and I’m like, “IBM? Really?” And so, he says, “Can you come in, and have a conversation with us?” And three interviews later, and, at the time, we did entrance exams, I was an IBM-er. So, I finished my exam on the Friday, and I started on the Monday. Now in retrospect, I probably should have taken some time off, a little bit, but I’ll never forget when I got that offer, because I cried, and my dad did, and the fact that he was so proud of me, and what I’ve accomplished meant everything to me.

Goldy Hyder

And here you are as the first female president of IBM Canada. What does that mean to you?

Deb Pimentel

It means a lot. When I was first given … So, I became the president in April, time frame. I’ve been at IBM for a long time, and getting here … I didn’t get here from I did one thing, and then all of a sudden now I became the president. I started at IBM, and I’ve done many different things within IBM. I’ve learned a lot of parts of our organization, and that was really important to me. I diversified my … I like to call it, diversification of my knowledge and my skills of the company. And so, I’ve done a few different roles. And so, when I was given that role, it was one of the proudest moments, because I have only been at IBM. I’ve only worked at IBM for straight out of school.

It’s such an honor to … You saw some of the people here. It is an incredible honor to be the leader for all of this brilliance, and the talent that we have in our organization. So, that’s fantastic.

But then you look at the first female piece of it. That one took a little bit to absorb, because, at first, I’m like, “Let’s not talk about the female piece. I’m the president of IBM. This is fantastic.”

But it is so important, because I’m showing other females that it’s possible. Right? So, that’s the biggest piece for me being the first female, it’s really showing people that if you stay focused, you stay connected, you network, you learn different things, there is possibility for females, and males in our society.

Goldy Hyder

Tell me the role of mentors. Often, when I’m speaking with women leaders, it strikes me as interesting how many times they say their main mentors were actually men.

Deb Pimentel

Yeah, and I’ll likely say the same thing, which is interesting. I have grown up in a, one would call, male-dominated industry. I wouldn’t say that anymore. We are a very-

Goldy Hyder

Clearly not. Look at who I’m looking at.

Deb Pimentel

No. No. And our population is really good from a female/male perspective. We’re very diverse. But growing up, I did have many mentors. You could start with my dad, who pushed, and didn’t treat you a certain way. He did push you to think differently. Right?

But the majority of my mentors have been males. Absolutely. Especially in the last little bit to get to where I am, pushing me … How do you think about things differently?

So, I am a very big believer in allies. I think that men should, and could be allies for females, and for the newer generation that’s coming in, but there are also many females that I talk to all the time, whether they’re peers, whether they work for me, or I work for them. There are many females now, which is a really nice thing, because a lot of people ask me about the mentor piece. And so, yes, if I was to pinpoint one, or two people, they are males, but there’s been a lot of female in my career that have said, “Why can’t you do it? Let’s do this. Do this for us.”

Goldy Hyder

And you’re a mentor now for many-

Deb Pimentel

Yes.

Goldy Hyder

… as well.

Deb Pimentel

Yes.

Goldy Hyder

And I know you’ve given a lot of time in particular for women-

Deb Pimentel

Yes.

Goldy Hyder

… women leaders, and I think recently, you’d even had Hayley Wickenheiser here. Tell us why you did that.

Deb Pimentel

Such a moment of pride. I love Hayley.

Goldy Hyder

Yeah. Tell me a little bit about that.

Deb Pimentel

So, again, back to the topic of mentors, and thinking about mentors, and role models. So, to me, the most important thing for a female, or a male, is to be able to see someone doing that role. So, we do a lot of STEM work here. I love to bring in young girls into our organization to teach them what can they do with STEM? And what I started to realize when I was talking to the younger generation is they don’t see the leaders in certain spaces.

So, what I’m trying to do is to build a network of females, and bringing together females that, typically, are in industries that maybe it’s been tough in the past. Hayley, like, broke through, fantastically successful, in a very male-dominated industry.

So, I’m looking and searching for these women to come in, and talk to other women. So, I’m creating a space for us to network, but not just we’re networking, because we’re females. We’re networking with purpose.

So, “What did you have to go through? What are the ways that you broke through maybe a stigma?” Or, “How did you break through in this space where there’s all males, and now you’re actually the associate general manager, and you’re teaching these males? How do you do that?”

And I think it’s really important for us to listen to that, and learn from each other.

Goldy Hyder

Well, first of all, as a father of three daughters, let me say thank you. It’s really important. I’m going to say something controversial now.

Deb Pimentel

Okay.

Goldy Hyder

And that is that I have found that women are sure tough on other women.

Deb Pimentel

Oh, yeah.

Goldy Hyder

And women are not as supportive as you might think of other women’s success. Is that fair? That’s just an observation I’ve had. I’ve managed a lot of it.

Deb Pimentel

Is it a fair observation?

Goldy Hyder

Yeah.

Deb Pimentel

Yeah. It’s a very fair observation.

Goldy Hyder

Why is that, Deb?

Deb Pimentel

I think that it’s a lot to do with there may be a feeling that there aren’t a lot of roles, or positions out there. So, “I need to fight,” and if there’s a rule that says, “You need to have a female,” which we should talk about the doing it on purpose, “Then if I’m fighting for that one role, then I need to beat you.”

Goldy Hyder

Right.

Deb Pimentel

Right? Maybe that’s what it is. It’s also a you don’t see a lot of other females, and you’re like, “I need to act as if I am just like everybody else.”

I realized that early in my career, and it has actually been something that I’m very, very focused about breaking. So, here’s how I do it. I don’t try, I purposely try not to act as if I’m someone else. I don’t want to follow a mold. I’m me. I need to be authentic to who I am, and I need to show other people that.

Now let’s go back to organizations, and what they can do. When you sit, and you say, “We need to make sure that we hit a diversity target. So, we have to have a certain amount of women,” that’s good. You need to do that. As an organization, you need to do it on purpose, because you have to be conscious of the fact that are we opening the doors for a diverse population? Are we doing it on purpose?

This is a generalization, but females, typically, are not the ones that are putting themselves out there enough. So, we actually are going out, and asking, “Would you think about doing this? How about this?” Right?

So, we need to do that on purpose. When you just say, “Look, I have my one token female,” that’s where you’re going to have a lot of fighting. You need to show women that it’s possible, that they don’t have to fight each other, that it’s all about merit. It’s all about what is it that you’re producing, and what is it that you’re giving back to the company.

And you need to be open about it. So, thank you for asking that question, because a lot of people don’t like to talk about it, but it is true. It’s a competition that shouldn’t be there. We need to be very aware of that, otherwise, we won’t stop it.

Goldy Hyder

I’m of the view that if we don’t talk about it, it will linger.

Deb Pimentel

Yes.

Goldy Hyder

And it will hold back the progress-

Deb Pimentel

Yes.

Goldy Hyder:

But let me come back to the sector in which you are, because, again, you mentioned it was seen to be somewhat male-dominated for a long period of time, but we’re living in a time in which some have said that we need more EQ in our leaders, and not just IQ.

So, I was struck by your own education pedigree of being in business, and being in psychology. Do you feel that this may be a time where women are better equipped to lead, and help solve some of the problems that we’re seeing, not just in business, but in society?

Deb Pimentel

Absolutely I do. Now let’s talk about why I did the psychology and the business. I tell people all the time, “I use my psychology degree more than I use my business most of the time.”

Because no matter what you do, it’s about people. It’s about having a conversation, and understanding that person. I think that right now where we’re at, that is so important. Understanding, and being able to bring out what’s at your core, that’s how we build cultures. That’s how we build organizations, people that want to work for organizations, people that want to make you successful as a leader of an organization, that is the EQ piece of it.

Goldy Hyder

Yeah. The loyalty. The loyalness.

Deb Pimentel

The loyalty piece. Right? Like, lots of changes have happened in the world over the past few years, and that piece has become more important than ever. You need to be able to … How do you connect with different people? But how do you have conversations that might be tough?

Goldy Hyder

Yeah. Might be uncomfortable.

Deb Pimentel

They might be uncomfortable.

Goldy Hyder

Yeah. Yeah.

Deb Pimentel

In the past, we might have said, “Here is what you do, let’s move on. This is our strategy.” There are humans behind making sure that that strategy is successful, and they’re all different. And so, one-size doesn’t fit all.

So, there does require a lot more EQ, and humanness. I call it the human factor, which is how is it going to impact you? How do I get the most out of the people that work in this organization? And make them feel like they’re part of it, that they’re part of the success?

So, to me, absolutely, EQ, I think is what’s going to take us into our future of being much more successful.

Goldy Hyder

Well, look, I get the chance to visit a lot of places, let me say that, and I’m not just saying this at you, because you’re here, but there’s a vibe here. There’s an energy here. There’s a feeling that people are happy to come to work, and happy to be here, and happy to be here together. So, well-done.

Now what they’re doing here is actually really important.

Deb Pimentel

Yes.

Goldy Hyder

Not just for IBM, but for Canada. Talk to me a little bit now about the importance of IBM Canada when it comes to innovation within the IBM network.

Deb Pimentel

So, the building that we’re in today, this is a huge point of pride for us. This is the largest software development lab in Canada, and it is one of three, you were saying, in the world for IBM.

So, what you see here is we are building software for data, hybrid cloud, AI, that’s being built here for Canadian organizations, but also for the world. So, it’s extremely impactful. It is a big point of pride for us. Now this isn’t the only building that differentiates us from a Canadian perspective in the global world. We also have our Bromont facility. So, that’s our semiconductor plant.

Goldy Hyder

In Quebec.

Deb Pimentel

In Quebec. So, that one, we build semiconductor assembly plant, and that also is for Canadian clients, but also for the world. Because of the talent pool that we have here, we’re creating jobs for people here. You also had an opportunity to meet our expert lab team. These are individuals that help our clients implement the software that they buy, and be successful, and get the quickest return on investment. That team is in Canada. It’s one of three in the world. So, it’s a global delivery centre. So, they serve Canadian clients, but we also serve global clients.

And that is really important, because we have an incredible talent pool in this country, and it’s our way of, “How do we bring in the talent? Help them innovate, help them grow, and feel like it’s not just …” It is absolutely about our country, but we are very relevant on the world stage.

Goldy Hyder

Yeah. What a great brand to have as a country-

Deb Pimentel

Yeah.

Goldy Hyder

… that you have smart people.

Deb Pimentel

Yes.

Goldy Hyder

Now these smart people, you mentioned AI, are actively engaged, and readying I guess for a world that everybody says is going to be fundamentally different. We’re waiting to see that. People have said it could be equal to the internet having arrived.

It seems like we’re very much at still the starters’ gate, or maybe 10 meters into a long race. Where do you think we are with AI? Just from a big picture perspective before drilling down into the obvious stuff around what kind of an impact is it going to have on society, and on jobs, and so forth.

Deb Pimentel

So, I think we are at the beginning. Now Canadians, we tend to be more conservative. The good news is we’ve started. Most organizations are dabbling, some larger organizations have started to implement within their companies, but we’re just at the beginning of where this could be, and where we could go

Organizations are using AI, if it’s embedded in some of the software they’re using to summarize some meetings. So, those-

Goldy Hyder

More basics.

Deb Pimentel

More basics. We have a lot of organizations that are doing, for example, pilots, because they’re thinking about how could, what could AI be. But we’re not seeing those pilots necessarily convert as quickly as some of the other technologies.

So, I think there’s still some … They’re being cautious. It’s also an ever-changing environment. So, we started with large language models, these big behemoth models, and now things are changing in that space, and there’s lots of new players coming in.

It can get very overwhelming, and so, what we tend to tell clients is, “Do something small, prove it out, it helps productivity, and then let’s move forward.”

Is it new? This is new, and it’s something that everyone is talking about, but we’ve been doing AI-

Goldy Hyder

Decades.

Deb Pimentel

For decades.

Goldy Hyder

For decades.

Deb Pimentel

We’ve been doing it for a long time. I think the newness of it is how much everybody has embraced it.

Goldy Hyder

Ttell me more about the human element, because, of course, one of the things, the anxiety that people feel when technology advances, they want the benefits of it all, but they’re also very concerned about the impact on me, but, particularly, my job.

Deb Pimentel

Yeah.

Goldy Hyder

History shows that they actually shouldn’t be too worried, that skills change, and new jobs become available, but is that going to be the case with AI? Are we going to see really a reduction of career opportunities, or job opportunities, because they will be automated? And what’s going to happen to those people.

Deb Pimentel

I don’t believe there will be a reduction, because of AI. I believe there’ll be a change, because of AI. So, what you’re doing today, we’re going to be absolutely … There’s jobs, that people may have. They’re doing redundant tasks. They’re doing some tasks that can be replaced with AI. It’s very easy. We want that. That’s progress. That’s automation.

Goldy Hyder

That’s part of the productivity argument.

Deb Pimentel

Absolutely. Right? However, the important thing here is the world is changing, and I think there’s more opportunity with AI coming in doing different things, thinking differently, innovating differently.

So, I think there will always be opportunities. I think that this now just opens up the opportunity for people to do different things, and to do it in a different way, think differently.

So, people need to stop saying, “Oh, we’re going to lose our jobs,” because that keeps you in today. You have to think of what the future will bring, and the opportunity that AI is going to bring to everyone. It’ll touch everybody.

And so, how can you take that, and do something different? A little bit more innovative? A little bit more productive for your organization? How do I help my company grow differently?

So, I’ll give you an example. At IBM, we implemented something called Ask HR. So, that was one of the areas that we implemented AI. And so, you could say, “Oh, there’s a lot of people in HR that their jobs, they’re gone.” So, yes. So, a lot of the tasks that people were asking day-to-day, common, all the time asking these … There was always an individual there that we had to go to.

Goldy Hyder

Insurance questions, or whatever.

Deb Pimentel

Exactly. Right? So, your background, insurance questions. These things can be answered with AI. So, we’ve had over two million requests come through Ask HR, which it’s an assistant-

Goldy Hyder

So, people are using it.

Deb Pimentel

Right. They’re absolutely using it. And 94% to 95% accuracy. We don’t need anybody else. But you know now what we’ve been able to do, we’re doing creative and different things with those HR people.

Goldy Hyder

Yeah.

Deb Pimentel

We’ve retrained them. So, the biggest piece about AI is retraining skilling. So, constantly be learning-

Goldy Hyder

And whose job is that?

Deb Pimentel

I think it’s the individual’s job. I think, for me, I’m constantly-

Goldy Hyder

Learning.

Deb Pimentel

… learning.

Goldy Hyder

Yeah.

Deb Pimentel

Constantly. So, I would suggest that each individual should constantly be learning, and reading. You can’t go anywhere without seeing something about AI these days. So, make sure that you’re learning.

However, it is also the organization’s responsibility, because we want to make sure that we’re getting the most out of our employees. We want them to be successful, because if they’re successful, we’re successful. We are very much focused at IBM on training. Training, training, training is what I’ve always done. The amount of years that I’ve been here, 29 years that I’ve been here, we are always focused on training our employees, and that has not stopped.

If anything, it’s become … If you ask any IBM-er, we’re always-

Goldy Hyder

All the time. Yeah.

Deb Pimentel

… always learning.

Goldy Hyder

Well, it reminds me of a saying. Someone had said, “You won’t lose your job to AI. You will lose your job to someone who knows how to use AI.”

Deb Pimentel

That’s good. Yes.

Goldy Hyder

The other thing, of course, is partners like universities and colleges, and government also have a role to play-

Deb Pimentel

Absolutely.

Goldy Hyder

… in skills.

Deb Pimentel

Absolutely.

Goldy Hyder

Now we talked about the opportunities. Let’s talk a little bit about the risks, because there is a constituency of people out there who are saying, “Oh my God. We’ve got to regulate, and manage, and control all of this in some, way, shape, or form.” First of all, is it even possible to do that? And, secondly, will that, in some way, do more harm than good? If it constrains the creativity, and the utilization, and the ingenuity behind it all.

Deb Pimentel

I do believe that there needs to be governance around AI. And I believe that it needs to be done with organizations, with government, with academic institutions, because we’re all talking about it. We go across Canada meeting different people in universities.

This is what they’re studying. There’s a big passion out there for AI. But you do need to have governance around it. You don’t want to stifle innovation. You want people to be very, very creative, but as we have a responsibility to … There are a lot of regulated organizations as well. You need to be able to explain where the information is coming from. How did you come up with this?

So, we do believe that governance is important, and we do believe that open conversations with academia, and with governments is extremely important.

So, just keep on talking about it. We want innovation. We don’t want to stifle that. But you need to have governance around how you deploy AI in your organizations.

Goldy Hyder

Let’s talk about, to conclude, something you and I share a great passion for, and that is love of Canada. You talked about it right off the top, being a first-generation Canadian. Tell me a little bit about how you see our country in terms of where we are in the world, what it means to be Canadian. What are your hopes for this country?

Deb Pimentel

I am so proud of being a Canadian, and I think that that probably has to do with my family, who is incredibly proud of being Canadians. I asked my dad the other day, and he’s like, “When we came here, we came for growth opportunities. We came here for the promise of being able to do better for your family, and give opportunity.”

And then he said, “We always thought we would go back, and then we just never wanted to. And this is our home.” They-

Goldy Hyder

Isn’t that interesting?

Deb Pimentel

… are Canadians. They are not Portuguese citizens. They are Canadian citizens. And that pride is something that I’ve always had, and now that I get to work with global organizations, and in the role that I’m in, I get to meet a lot of those Canadians.

And so, one of the things that I do is I get to go across, and talk to students, or people that are earlier on in their careers. There is an incredible amount of talent here right across the country.

And so, that talent, one of my biggest passions is how do we create opportunity for those people to want to work for Canadian organizations? And give back to the Canadian people.

So, how do we make sure … I do it on purpose. I make sure that I’m going, and I’m creating an environment where it’s exciting for this next generation to come in, and want to work here in Canada for Canada. And that you don’t have to go anywhere else. You can be right here with a lot of really smart people, and you can do things for companies outside of Canada too right here on our own land.

So, to me, it is really important for us to create an environment, and to create spaces for our own people to be successful. Right? And that also means we need to create and think bigger. We need to stop being so conservative, and we need to be loud and proud. I say that to my team all the time, “Loud and proud. Let’s get out there,” because it’s incredible how many fantastic things we do that we don’t talk about. We should want people to see that, and to want to come, and work with us.

Goldy Hyder

I feel like we bring it on the ice. It’s all about winning hockey.

Deb Pimentel

Yes.

Goldy Hyder

If we could take that same mentality, and put it to our economy, and our country. And the importance of celebrating success.

Deb Pimentel

Absolutely.

Goldy Hyder

I think culturally, we sometimes have that syndrome of being next to the giant.

Deb Pimentel

Yeah.

Goldy Hyder

And we need to learn a little bit from them on some of the things that they’ve used to their advantage, and part of that is the moxie to say, “Yeah. We’re the best”-

Deb Pimentel

Absolutely.

Goldy Hyder

… “And if we’re not, we’re going to try to be.”

Deb Pimentel

Yes. By the way, here’s the other thing, we do … This is an example. We create a lot of interesting things here. And then we’re so-

Goldy Hyder

We don’t scale.

Deb Pimentel

… nice.

Goldy Hyder

Yeah.

Deb Pimentel

We’re so nice, and then somebody else comes and sees, and they, “Whoa. Let me take this, and make this something,” and all of a sudden, it becomes their idea. We need to stop that. Right? We need to make sure that we take credit for the things that we’re doing.

And it really does … It’s on all of us to make sure that we’re loud, and that we say, “Look at the things that we’re doing.” We should be extremely proud of what we have here, not only from a talent perspective, but the resources that we have. We need to be much more passionate about that, and vocal about it, not just a, “Oh, it’s cold up there. Isn’t it?”

Goldy Hyder

Well, look, thank you for being both vocal, and passionate about this on this podcast. We’ve gotten through all the easy questions. Now comes the fun part, the rapid-fire questions. These are usually tougher than the other questions I’ve asked you. So, I’m just going to fire away, and you can give me your answers. Your favorite sports team?

Deb Pimentel

The Toronto Maple Leafs. I have to say it’s the Toronto Maple Leafs.

Goldy Hyder

Really?

Deb Pimentel

Yeah.

Goldy Hyder

That’s the wrong answer, but, okay.

Deb Pimentel

See, I knew you were going to give me that, but it is. My parents, my family since I was a … I have a picture of myself cheering them on when I was ninth months old.

Goldy Hyder

It’s part of that belonging thing. Isn’t it?

Deb Pimentel

Yeah.

Goldy Hyder

You’ve got to like hockey.

Deb Pimentel

It’s perseverance too.

Goldy Hyder

Yes. Yes. There is that some day.

Deb Pimentel

Yes.

Goldy Hyder

I think the last time was when I was born, the year I was born. Best way to relax on the weekend?

Deb Pimentel

I love going up north to my cottage, which is small, and I get to spend time with my family, and read, and look at the water. Love it.

Goldy Hyder

Your best place to spend a vacation?

Deb Pimentel

Is the Azores. I love going back. We go back every couple of years. I love going back home.

Goldy Hyder

Your favorite book genre?

Deb Pimentel

So, there’s two. I really do like business books, leadership, specifically-

Goldy Hyder

Boy, you and I share a lot in common.

Deb Pimentel

Yeah. I love that. I could just read and read on that. So, that’s what I enjoy reading.

Goldy Hyder

Is there one that you like in particular?

Deb Pimentel

The latest one that I read was Setting The Table by Danny Meyer. So, I like that one, because it blends how is he running a business, the efficiency, the … It’s a really good book. He’s got many Michelin star restaurants, and it just talks about execution, about the importance of the client, and putting the client at the center of everything that you do.

So, I really do love that book, and then I happen to … Because of that, I watched that series The Bear. Have you watched that one?

Goldy Hyder

No. I have not.

Deb Pimentel

So, it’s really interesting, because it’s a very intense environment, because it’s all about trying to be as perfect as you can, but doing it with the client and the humanness of it. So, that’s the latest one that I read that I enjoyed.

Goldy Hyder

A good segue to what’s your favorite food?

Deb Pimentel

Oh, it’s bad that I’m not going to say Portuguese, but it’s sushi. Love. Could eat it every day.

Goldy Hyder

And finally, you’re in Toronto. What’s the part about Toronto that you love the most?

Deb Pimentel

Well, I love the diversity of Toronto. If I’d say one particular area of Toronto that I absolutely love is down by the water, specifically, around the Ontario Place area.

Goldy Hyder

Nice.

Deb Pimentel

When I was in university, and doing these multiple courses, I’d go down there to clear my mind, and to just … It’s a beautiful view of the city too.

Goldy Hyder

Well, look, you’ve given us a lot to think about. So, there’ll be no clearing minds for people listening to this podcast, but thank you for joining us, and thank you for sharing.

Deb Pimentel

Thank you so much for having me.

Goldy Hyder

Deb Pimentel is the President and GM of Technology for IBM Canada.

You can see photos and videos from our tour of the IBM lab on our website at thebusinesscouncil.ca/podcasts.

If you would like to hear more of our Speaking of Business conversations with innovators, leaders and entrepreneurs, why not subscribe? Search for Speaking of Business wherever you get your podcasts. And while you’re there, please give us a review.

Until next time, I’m Goldy Hyder. Thanks for joining us.